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Grifols Erytra


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With ProVue's phasing out, there are likely some of you out there assessing what to get for replacement (Vision; switch to Immucor Solid Phase.....or, Grifols Erytra).  We just purchased (and are now validating) the Erytra and I really like it (and NO, I promise I do not work for them and have no vested interest here:P).  If anyone would like to know of our experience thus far, would be happy to share.  NOTE:  We previously used ProVue's (and I have used Solid Phase elsewhere).

Thanks

Brenda Hutson, MT(ASCP)SBB

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Thanks Brenda.  I am currently narrowed down to purchasing the Ortho Vision or the Erytra.  The Erytra just seems so massive.  We are a small hospital and going from Ortho manual gel to automation.  The Erytra just seems to be a big step to me.  I have used the Provue and ECHO at other places as well.  What are you thoughts on the size?  Did you have to modify your lab to accommodate the Erytra?  Also, how are the gel card reactions compared to Ortho?  Easier to read?

 

Thanks for your input.

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You are correct, it is a high throughput machine.  We are also a small hospital (about 180 beds).  We use automation for the simple reason that we utilize mostly Generalists....so I just feel more comfortable with it.

We previously used ProVue's (had 2) and there was never any question that we would stay with GEL....I love it!  We did go look at both the Vision and the Erytra.  We found the Vision to be very noisy.  In addition, we had not been satisfied with the response by Ortho to our continuous complaints regarding one of the engineers they sent to us.  So our issues with Ortho also played into our decision to go with Grifols.

We did not have to modify our Lab (moved into new Hospital a few years ago and the Transfusion Service and wall space was actually quite large).  We had 1 of our ProVues on a bench against the wall, so just moved that out and put the Erytra there instead.  We also purchased 2 manual workstations and the DG Reader for manual reading (previously performed manual reading just visually, but I like this feature).

Obviously it is more than what we need for our workload (can accommodate 96 specimens; 400 cards; 4 reagent racks; 2 probes for simultaneous aspiration of 2 samples at a time; can hold 16L each of solutions A and B if you have an external drain; 8 each if you do not).  But I liked the keyboard and all of the information it allows you to access regarding anything/ everything going on.  Just think it has a lot of great features so looking forward to getting the training completed and moving on with it.

Since we are still in process of performing correlation testing (we did complete validation), I cannot yet comment much on reactions; difficulty of reading wells; sensitivity; etc.  Will let you know more as we go along.

Brenda

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We've been running on our Erytra for a while. I really like it, but I'm not thrilled with the range of their reagents. Only one panel has been limiting for us. We found it easier to continue purchasing our ortho panel A and IgG cards. I'm also not thrilled with their service department, but I'm hopeful it will improve.

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  • 1 month later...

We have been told not to use the Ortho Panels (or Reagents) with Grifols GEL Cards....you can get erroneous results.  We have also always used the Immucor Panel (and apparently that is ok for Grifols GEL), and Grifols has just come out with a 2nd panel. They asked my opinion of the cells on the panels and I honestly told them I was not excited about the panels (not enough homozygous cells; NO K homozygous cell; etc.).  I have also requested that they designate cells on one of their 2 panels that can be used as a modified panel for Passive D (as both Ortho and Immucor do).  They are working on all of these issues.  What is good about Grifols is that they are very open to suggestions and recommendations for improvement and seem to be quick to act upon them.  So speak up to your Grifols Rep!

Brenda Hutson, MT(ASCP)SBB

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11 minutes ago, CMCDCHI said:

We are evaluating several systems right now too and I'm not excited that the Erytra uses bleach to clean.  I just removed all bleach from the blood bank not too long ago!

ORTHO ProVue also uses bleach to disinfect the lines.

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We are going to RFP this coming year for some new automated analyzers. We did a quick look this spring at what is out there. I am surprised no one is speaking about the Biorad analyzers:  newly released IH 500, IH1000 (Gel based) and Tango Infinity (4th generation solid phase analyzer) along with stand alone  Gel readers and centrifuges. Although we are not sure which direction we are heading, I think they are certainly worth mentioning.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi, Brenda - I work a UCSF.  We just purchased two Erytras that are going to be delivered soon.  I'm going to be writing the IQ/OQ validation plan (someone else will be writing the PQ), and would like to know if you could share your experience with Grifols regarding their installation/ operational plans.  Did you go to their training before creating your validation plan?  Did you incorporate Grifols IQ/OQ plans into your validation and get that approved prior to the company coming in and performing the IQ/OQ?  I've validated a lot of equipment, just never an analyzer, so any help regarding the best way to proceed with this would be really valuable. 
Thank you

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On 10/6/2016 at 3:39 PM, Brenda Hutson said:

With ProVue's phasing out, there are likely some of you out there assessing what to get for replacement (Vision; switch to Immucor Solid Phase.....or, Grifols Erytra).  We just purchased (and are now validating) the Erytra and I really like it (and NO, I promise I do not work for them and have no vested interest here:P).  If anyone would like to know of our experience thus far, would be happy to share.  NOTE:  We previously used ProVue's (and I have used Solid Phase elsewhere).

Thanks

Brenda Hutson, MT(ASCP)SBB

I recommend you hold off on your Vision until either the current issues with the IgG cards gets resolved or the camera can be adjusted for sensitivity! Almost all our patients require editing of the antibody cell screen results on the Vision due to weak false positive reactions. The camera is very sensitive and picks up the "small grainy clumps near the bottom the reaction wells. Consider looking at the Biorad  analyzer (just received FDA approval) and the Grifols benchtop which is pending FDA approval - both gel systems!

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On 11/23/2016 at 9:39 AM, Brenda Hutson said:

We have been told not to use the Ortho Panels (or Reagents) with Grifols GEL Cards....you can get erroneous results.  We have also always used the Immucor Panel (and apparently that is ok for Grifols GEL), and Grifols has just come out with a 2nd panel. They asked my opinion of the cells on the panels and I honestly told them I was not excited about the panels (not enough homozygous cells; NO K homozygous cell; etc.).  I have also requested that they designate cells on one of their 2 panels that can be used as a modified panel for Passive D (as both Ortho and Immucor do).  They are working on all of these issues.  What is good about Grifols is that they are very open to suggestions and recommendations for improvement and seem to be quick to act upon them.  So speak up to your Grifols Rep!

Brenda Hutson, MT(ASCP)SBB

We use Ortho IgG with our Ortho Panel. We'll probably drop the ortho panel and reagents soon and order Immucor if we need an additional panel beyond the 2 Grifols panels.

Service has gotten much better, but it was a long road getting the right people to hear and recognize a few issues. I'd be surprised if anyone else experienced similar issues moving forward and our current team is really fantastic.

Overall, the analyzer is really pretty slick. There is definitely room to grow with the reagents, but hopefully there will be big improvements next year too.

 

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Currently validating our new Erytra, and am really pleased.  All of the techs who have used it so far love it.  Incredibly simple to use and very intuitive.  Grifols is working on liquid antisera that can be used on the analyzer for both patients and units.  Really looking forward to that as well as a short panel to rule-out passive RhIg.  When you consider the number of cards that can be stored on-board, it's not leaving any bigger footprint than our ProVue.  28 minute STAT T&S (2cell) from the time we put the specimen on!

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So we went LIVE with our Erytra this week.  We had a couple of hardware issues along the way (though nothing major).  One change I made (and this was just a personal decision) to prophylactically prevent 1 type of issue, is that we changed the double-layer racks to single layer (so when we take them out of the box....we have saved empty racks after use so we place the top layer in a 2nd rack).  We do that because in training, they emphasize how you have to make sure the cards are patted down; that a corner doesn't pull back up, like maybe from your glove sticking; that the drawers must be closed very carefully or it could jar the cards.  Well,  you can "teach" your staff all of those things, but you KNOW it is going to happen (some heavy-handed tech. is going to come along and just slam the door shut.....then you are in trouble :blink: ).  So by making single-layer racks, we hope to decrease gripper vs. card issues.  Our workload is not so high that we needed the 2nd layer....even filling the Erytra with single-layer card racks in every space, is more than we would use in 24 hours. One thing to be careful with if you do that though is that when you are handling the cards, do it gently so as not to cause splashing within the wells; otherwise, you create another problem.  Another change we made is that it was initially connected to a drain.  After training (and learning to do decontamination), we decided to have it switched to reagent waste bottles.  Again, our workload is such that we would not even fill 1 of those bottles in 24 hours much less 2; so we cut down on the tedious decontamination process.

You also learn some things the hard way.....like if you remove a solution bottle to add more solution, don't close the drawer!  If you do and the analyzer is priming (or wants it for something else), it will disable the probes.  So leave the drawer open during the process.  There were several things like that we learned by making the mistake.  The more we use it, the more we learn (there is a lot to learn with the touchscreen).

But we still really like it.  There are some software changes we would like so they are adding them to a new version coming out next year.  Also, they definitely need to "beef up" their panels (and they know that).

All in all.....a good purchase.  My only outstanding concern is some missed weak antibodies (which we will continue to watch for.....for now, every questionable antibody screen will be repeated by Tube PeG).

Brenda Hutson, MT(ASCP)SBB

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Congrats on your go live! We had a bumpy start and a possessed analyzer, but it's much better now. I really like the analyzer and I really like our TAS and FSE. They do feel like an immature company in that they are newer in the US and seemed to struggle with supporting their staff as they've grown, BUT they seem to hear us and resolve our issues. We've been working with them a long time and I've seen dramatic improvements and growth, I don't think other hospitals or systems would experience the same rockiness.

We had a few learning curves too. I'm happy to share, if it helps anyone else avoid some of our self-induced problems.

1. People kept throwing away the service racks when emptied-not understanding they were service racks. The Erytra would dump the cards ok in the service rack space, but when it went to get one, it couldn't find them. 

2. If it freezes on you, DON'T hard reboot by pushing the start button. Use a mouse to right click, click global settings-not to use the global settings but to access the windows start menu and shut it down that way.

3. You'll save yourself a lot of headaches if you turn it off every night instead of letting it go to sleep for 20 minutes for your daily maintenance.

4. GENTLY shut the doors. We had to slam our Provue shut-so gentle touches have been difficult. Not being gentle can cause reagent splashing and possibly even splashing in gel cards too.

5. Don't let the Wash bottles get too low. We'll easily go through a full wash A container/day. Staff would get busy and not realize it would get super low or empty and start to cause issues. I ordered back up bottles and always have one ready to go on so they swap them when needed and clean and refill the container at their leisure.

6. Make sure your staff knows if there is a red triangle that they need to investigate and resolve the issue, not modify or accept. We allow some hemolysis as long as the gel card isn't more hemolyzed than the original sample. ANY other red triangle means there an issue and the test MUST be repeated.

 

I'm sure there lots more that I'm not thinking of at the moment. If you have any questions, I'm happy to answer and share our experiences.

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On October 7, 2016 at 7:21 AM, mld123 said:

Thanks Brenda.  I am currently narrowed down to purchasing the Ortho Vision or the Erytra.  The Erytra just seems so massive.  We are a small hospital and going from Ortho manual gel to automation.  The Erytra just seems to be a big step to me.  I have used the Provue and ECHO at other places as well.  What are you thoughts on the size?  Did you have to modify your lab to accommodate the Erytra?  Also, how are the gel card reactions compared to Ortho?  Easier to read?

 

Thanks for your input.

 

IMG_0471.jpg

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Picture of Erytra side by side with Vision.  Vision actually takes up more floor space.  When you consider many medium to large hospitals will need multiple Visions then space is a much bigger issue with Vision.

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  • 4 weeks later...
On December 15, 2016 at 0:47 PM, gmenfl said:

I recommend you hold off on your Vision until either the current issues with the IgG cards gets resolved or the camera can be adjusted for sensitivity! Almost all our patients require editing of the antibody cell screen results on the Vision due to weak false positive reactions. The camera is very sensitive and picks up the "small grainy clumps near the bottom the reaction wells. Consider looking at the Biorad  analyzer (just received FDA approval) and the Grifols benchtop which is pending FDA approval - both gel systems!

Grifols desktop model is called the Erytra Eflexis. I've been told that it's supposed to be coming out in Europe in 2017.  

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